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Tunisian gauge 2

11303 views 15 replies Latest reply: July 5, 2014 at 5:11:14 PM

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BetwixtTheStitch message #1
Tunisian gauge 2
June 11, 2014 at 8:51:34 AM

Recently we were discussing how tunisian simple stitch is taller than it is wide, so you really don't get "square" stitches for making a picture.

Well I started racking my brains on that one, because I remember having square stitches to cross stitch on, many years ago.
Has my memory failed me? That was 50 some years ago, after all.

That's when I remembered, I didn't learn it with ww yarn. Worsted yarn wasn't even that popular back then.

So now I'm on a mission to find yarns that work as well as I remember.

I've worked up some swatches with Simply Soft Light on both H and I afghan hooks, this is close to the tunisian as I remember it.
With the H hook, I got 20st x 20r in a 4x4" square
the I hook yielded 18st x 18r

Then I tried a sport weight and J hook yielded 14st x14r square.

I have other sizes to try, but this is what I've come up with so far. Of course your gauge may be slightly different due to a difference in tension.

You can nake your stitches slightly wider with a looser return pass, or narrower with a tighter return pass.

My favorite online store, which has been around for as long as I can remember, has some really yummy colors in fine afghan yarn that I will be trying out. But you can see them here
http://www.herrschners.com/Product/Herrschnersand174+2Ply+Afghan+Yarn.aspx

I'll post my findings as soon as I have them.

Sherry

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Posts: 4610

Stitchboard Admin message #2
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 11, 2014 at 10:25:36 PM (in response to BetwixtTheStitch message #1)

Sherry,

Wow, that's so interesting...because I'd also thought I'd remembered reading and being told the gauge was strictly square! But every time I looked at it, everything was rectangular. Every afghan pattern, every gauge swatch, everything.

That also explains something else...because when I started crocheting, worsted weight was mainly what I'd find. Sure, there were other weights (very fine baby pompadour, anyone?), but most fell in the worsted weight area. (That's also going by my main access to yarn in those days...Woolworth's. By the time I found a yarn shop near my job, I'd already been crocheting and knitting for a year or two, and they carried a lot of specialty - e.g., expensive - yarns, so that was my introduction to yarns other than Red Heart, as well as more yarns in other weights, particularly the novelty yarns.) Of course, when you first learn, you tend to go more with what's available to you than with what you really want and can't find! (I didn't know of Herrschner's originally...just Woolworth.)

By then, the heyday of square Tunisian was long over, and except for notations in old magazines, the square Tunisian was no more.

What a find!

So glad you took the time to test this out, and I'm going to say we need to add a square version to the Free Pattern Wizard, as well.

So were the afghan yarns of yesterday that thin? If so, do you think they held more detail...on purpose, as opposed to today's wider worsted weights? Or do you think it was simply what people used, as it had been done before that, and nobody knew any different?

Loving those gorgeous colors of the Herrschner's 2-ply afghan yarn! Lots and lots of great choices. And the wonderful advantage of ordering online...the maximum number of choices. Our LYS went away a long time ago, sigh, but there were often limited choices, anyway, since they could only stock so much. And the big box stores don't stock all of the colors, either, often choosing to discontinue many.

It's understandable that they're getting rid of the ones that don't sell as well, but still makes it so difficult to find whatever one might need!

Melanie (cat slave and Official Feline Can Opener) =^.^=
~~~~~
I'm a beading, knitting and crochet addict. If that means I'm admitting I have a problem, then I admit to nothing. Please refrain from helping me.

Member since:
Jul 3, 2013
Posts: 575

BetwixtTheStitch message #3
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 12, 2014 at 10:31:12 AM (in response to Stitchboard Admin message #2)

Melanie,

I agree that we need a square version of the Pattern Wizard.

I remember that most of what was available at the time was finer yarn, so that was what we used. The finer detail was what we were used to.

In fact I remember being disappointed in the look of ww when I first started using it, but it worked up faster, so I got used to it as it became more widely available. Though there were certain things I just wouldn't make with it, like garments.

I was kind of spoiled and didn't even know it, I guess.

Just about every department store had a craft section, including Penney's. We had a main street that was one store after another, so if you didn't like the selection at one, you could go next door. Or I could hop on a bus and ride a few miles to the Super Yarn Mart.

Sherry

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Member since:
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Posts: 4610

Stitchboard Admin message #4
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 12, 2014 at 11:42:27 PM (in response to BetwixtTheStitch message #3)

Sherry,

Hoping we have a square version in the Free Pattern Wizard soon!

Maybe by the time you read this.

It only makes sense, now that I think about it, to have used finer yarns for Tunisian afghans back then. The detail was there...and since that was what they mainly sold years ago, that's what they would use for Tunisian!

WW would definitely look terrible next to such finely detailed yarns, until you became accustomed to it.

So what did you end up using for garments? Sport weight?

I did actually make a sweater years ago with the RH WW. Meh, could have been better. It was fine softness-wise, since it softened up in the wash, but it pilled like crazy!

I had no idea Penney's used to sell craft supplies! It's just pitiful today...craft sections are so rare.

And a Super Yarn Mart...accessible by bus...be still my heart!

It's kind of sad how we get used to certain things...and then they go away very quickly.

There are so many yarns, craft items, stores and such that I thought would always be around...but they've all been slowly disappearing.

Member since:
Jul 3, 2013
Posts: 575

BetwixtTheStitch message #5
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 13, 2014 at 8:15:26 AM (in response to Stitchboard Admin message #4)

Melanie,

I did up swatches in the Herschner's 2 ply, this is the way I remember yarn being.

I did 4 swatches with different size hooks, all are 4 x 4"

F hook- 21st x 20r
G hook-20st x 20r
H hook-19st x 19r
I hook- 17st x 17r

This yarn would give a good base for cross stitching on.

Actually, I even think sport is too thick for garments.

I used crochet cotton thread for anything I thought needed to be finer, until I couldn't see it well enough anymore.
Sometimes I would try again with the ww, but I just really don't like it.

So my next project is to work up swatches in tks, and tps to get a feel for the gauge and the drape.

If anyone else has a favorite yarn they'd like me to try, I'm open to suggestions with 2 contingencies.
1. It has to be reasonable in cost and availability, and
2. I can't work with wool

Sherry

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Member since:
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Posts: 4610

Stitchboard Admin message #6
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 13, 2014 at 11:56:20 PM (in response to BetwixtTheStitch message #5)

Sherry,

This is perfect, and it really does make sense from the old magazine patterns, which talked about a square stitch, but I simply haven't been able to locate anything other than rectangular in recent years!

I agree...it would be great for cross stitching! Face it, it's the way cross stitching was always meant to be done...with an even, square stitch!

Wow, didn't garments take forever with the crochet cotton thread? Also, wasn't it a lot stiffer to work with it?

I don't mind the WW, though it depends on the fiber.

It will be very interesting to see if you get the same squareness with the other stitches!

That's a great idea...anyone have a readily available fiber they're itching to know about?

Member since:
Jul 3, 2013
Posts: 575

BetwixtTheStitch message #7
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 14, 2014 at 8:00:12 AM (in response to Stitchboard Admin message #6)

Melanie,

Pretty much everything took forever, but understand, we made a lot of tablecloths, bedspreads, etc. from crochet cotton back then.

Maybe it was stiffer, I guess I worked with it so much that I didn't notice. Of course, it had to be ironed after washing, like most of our clothes.

I've finished the Simply Soft Light in the tks, and I'll post them together with the Herrschner's when I finish them all.

Sherry

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Member since:
Jul 1, 2009
Posts: 4610

Stitchboard Admin message #8
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 15, 2014 at 1:02:28 AM (in response to BetwixtTheStitch message #7)

Sherry,

So true. My Grandma made some beautiful items, probably before I was born. Doilies, runners, etc. I used to have them (but my idiot ex "lost" them). I cherished them, and I especially remember the tiny stitches, as they were made with the crochet cotton!

My plan was to tea dye them (they were stained from use) and put them on my furniture someday...of course that will never happen now.

True, if you were used to it, as it was all you had, why would you notice a difference?!

B-b-b-b-b-but...ironing?! ACK!

Did it have to be ironed because it was cotton?!

Can't wait to see how it went with the SS Light TKS!

Member since:
Jul 3, 2013
Posts: 575

BetwixtTheStitch message #9
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 15, 2014 at 8:54:14 AM (in response to Stitchboard Admin message #8)

Melanie,

I think part of it was just the nature of the stitches, together with the cotton thread. It just needed to be blocked after every wash.
But we used to starch and iron everything, even after permanent press came along it was hard to give up the ironing.

Permanent press just doesn't have the same "feel" to it.

Sure, I hated ironing (but I hated washing dishes too), it was just one of those things that had to be done.

I've had a houseful of visitors the last couple of days and haven't had time to do much crochet, things should settle down by tomorrow.

Sherry

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Member since:
Jul 1, 2009
Posts: 4610

Stitchboard Admin message #10
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 15, 2014 at 11:02:24 PM (in response to BetwixtTheStitch message #9)

Sherry,

Oh, man, blocking after every wash?!

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

I'm sure nobody even questioned back then why everything had to be starched and ironed. Like anything else, you really don't know what's better until it comes along.

I'm sure permanent press is nothing like the old starching and ironing...but you know how I feel about that...LOL, I'll gladly take the permanent press over the better feel of starching and ironing any day!

I hope your visitors haven't been running you ragged, anyway, that you've had a chance to really enjoy their company!

Member since:
Jul 3, 2013
Posts: 575

BetwixtTheStitch message #11
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 16, 2014 at 8:40:05 AM (in response to Stitchboard Admin message #10)

Melanie,

I don't iron much anymore.

Can't say I'm sorry to see it go, either.

It was a nice weekend, and nice to get back to normal too.

Sherry

Look at that smile! (Photo guaranteed unretouched)

Member since:
Jul 1, 2009
Posts: 4610

Stitchboard Admin message #12
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
June 16, 2014 at 10:36:41 PM (in response to BetwixtTheStitch message #11)

Sherry,

LOL, you're not sorry to get away from hours of standing on your feet, ironing?!

I'm so glad you had a nice weekend!

Even the best visitors can be stressful.

Member since:
Jul 3, 2013
Posts: 575

BetwixtTheStitch message #13
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
July 4, 2014 at 8:49:06 AM (in response to Stitchboard Admin message #12)

Sorry it's taken so long to post this, my back has been acting up and that kinds limits the time I can spend on the computer.

Blah

Anyway, this is what I found with Herrschnerr's 2 ply afghan yarn in tunisian knit stitch.

Again all measurements are 4"x 4"
G hook- 20st x 24r
H hook- 19stx 22r
I hook- 17stx 21r
J hook- 16stx 20r
K hook- 15stx 19r

I found the I-K hooks to have the best drape if this yarn were to be used for garments.

With the Simply Soft Light, I started with an H hook as it's rated as a category 3

H hook- 19stx 24r
I hook- 18stx 22r
J hook- 17stx 20r
K hook- 17stx 19r
L hook- 15 stx 17r

The J-L hooks had the best drape.

Sherry

Look at that smile! (Photo guaranteed unretouched)

Member since:
Jul 1, 2009
Posts: 4610

Stitchboard Admin message #14
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
July 4, 2014 at 9:21:17 PM (in response to BetwixtTheStitch message #13)

Sherry,

Thanks for doing that and reporting back!

Looks to me like we're back to a horizontal stitch...did I get that right? If so, I think that confirms what we've been saying all along, that the horizontal stitch is correct for TKS.

Hope your back gets better soon!

Member since:
Jul 3, 2013
Posts: 575

BetwixtTheStitch message #15
Re: Tunisian gauge 2
July 5, 2014 at 8:17:00 AM (in response to Stitchboard Admin message #14)

Melanie,

Yes that's right, the tks is wider and shorter no matter what size hook and weight of yarn.

Since the stitches kind of overlap, it just makes sense.

Thank you, I'm feeling better now. You know, until the next time I get nutty and do something I probably shouldn't.

Sherry

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